Transcript:
Mark: Hello Tradmen listeners, and welcome back to the program. Tonight’s episode is a very special one, and we have a very special guest with us. Normally, when we start our episodes, you’ll notice that either Jason and I, or Jason or I, will lead with a prayer. But this time, we decided to let our guest lead the prayer. I would have introduced our guest at the beginning of the podcast, but I was rushing a bit because I was late to the interview. That was my fault, and I’m very grateful that our guest was patient with us.
Our guest tonight is our bishop, Athanasius Schneider. He is a Catholic prelate serving as the Auxiliary Bishop of Astana, Kazakhstan. He is a member of the Canons Regular of the Holy Cross of Combria. He writes and lectures prolifically on the preservation of Catholic tradition and the defense of authentic Catholic morals and teachings. He is a soldier in the army of Christ, a defender of the faith. We’re so blessed to have him on our program. This is going to be a truly inspiring episode. You’re going to want to listen to this one and stick around until the end, when His Excellency will bestow upon us, and all our listeners, the apostolic blessing. We hope you enjoy this episode, and thank you for watching.
Mark: Welcome back, Tradmen listeners. Thank you so much for being with us on this very special episode. We are incredibly blessed to have Bishop Athanasius Schneider joining us live from Kazakhstan. He’s going to be discussing his new book, The Springtime That Never Came.
As many of our listeners know, we usually open with a prayer, but since our esteemed guest is above us in the hierarchy, we’ve asked him to lead us in the opening prayer.
Monsignor, at your discretion.
Bishop Schneider: In nomine Patris et Filii et Spiritus Sancti. Amen.
Pater noster, qui es in cælis, sanctificétur nomen tuum. Advéniat regnum tuum. Fiat volúntas tua, sicut in cælo et in terra.
Panem nostrum cotidiánum da nobis hódie, et dimítte nobis débita nostra, sicut et nos dimíttimus debitóribus nostris. Et ne nos indúcas in tentatiónem, sed líbera nos a malo. Amen.
In nomine Patris et Filii et Spiritus Sancti. Amen.
Mark: Your Excellency, thank you so much for joining us. How are you, sir?
Bishop Schneider: Thank you. Thank you.
Mark: Good. So we had an opportunity to dig into your new book called The Springtime That Never Came, probably one of the most appropriately titled works I’ve read recently. Many of us in the Catholic Church, especially those of us who came up in the post-conciliar age, hear a lot about the “new springtime” of the Church. “Oh, what a wonderful springtime we’re in. Isn’t the new springtime wonderful?” And we look around and think, “It doesn’t feel much like springtime to us.”
So when I first came across your book, I said, Aha! I wasn’t wrong. I wasn’t crazy. Somebody else sees what I see. And not only did you see what I see, you saw it with a much more in-depth and, I think, more careful analysis in many ways. What was it that inspired you to give us this book now? Why this book at this time?
Bishop Schneider: Well, first, it was not my idea to publish this book. It was the Polish journalist Pawel Lisicki from Warsaw who had read my book Christus Vincit, a book-length interview with Diane Montagna, and he was inspired by that book. He phoned me and asked me to grant him an interview in order to deepen some aspects of my first book and to further discuss certain topics. So, this was his idea, and I accepted his request. That is how I came to do this second book with him.
Mark: Well, we’re definitely grateful that you did that. We’re coming up on almost a year since Traditionis Custodes, about another two months to be exact, since it was first released. I wanted to kind of take the temperature: what does everybody think the result has been? Has Traditionis Custodes gone the way Pope Francis thought it would? Do you think it has sort of blown up in his face? Or do you think, from his point of view, it’s largely been successful?
Bishop Schneider: I think partly so, at least as far as we can observe the effects of Traditionis Custodes. Of course, in some places it was implemented very strictly, and this is something we have to regret. In some dioceses, even some bishops carried it out almost with joy, seemingly happy to destroy the tradition. The true tradition. Unfortunately, those bishops and even Pope Francis recently say that we should not be attached to traditions, to “dead traditions.” But this venerable rite, which we have had for at least one millennium, is not dead. We have texts of the Mass and the order of the Mass dating back to the beginning of the second millennium, from the time of Pope Innocent III, the time of Saint Francis, for example. This is a long-standing tradition.
It was exactly the same rite before the Council of Trent. It’s not that the Council or Pope Pius V invented it. Pope Pius V simply made small adjustments to the Missal, not to the order of the Mass itself. So, it is not a newly created tradition. It is a liturgy that the saints lived and loved. What we see today, unfortunately, is that those who speak of “moving away from tradition” are often the ones who are actually attached to the fashions of the day, human traditions that disappear quickly. In contrast, the true tradition of the Church, the liturgy, the saints, and the centuries that is what we must preserve.
In other places, thankfully, some bishops have implemented Traditionis Custodes in a broader, more generous way. Thanks be to God. In fact, many have not strictly enforced or followed these norms. And again, thanks be to God, because Pope Francis, with this motu proprio, is not able to destroy this venerable liturgy. He cannot. This venerable liturgy is stronger than any one pope or any current persecution. The more it is persecuted, the more it will flourish. This is a kind of law, because it is not a purely human tradition. I repeat: it is a tradition filled and guided by the Holy Spirit in the Church through the centuries. And for this reason, we must remain confident and trust that it will continue. Perhaps in a more modest form for a time, but it will continue.
Jason: Your Excellency, on this topic, many in the hierarchy, and even among the laity, often say that we need to move away from tradition for the sake of progress. I know in your book, you talk about progress, and you bring up very good points about Pope John XXIII and his optimistic outlook on the world, and it seems that some people were conflating technology, technological progress, with the progress of humanity. What I got from that is that when we look at progress, progress doesn’t always mean it is positive. Would you say that’s a fair assessment? That just because something falls under the domain of progress, it doesn’t necessarily make it good.
Bishop Schneider: Of course, it depends on which direction the progress is going. When you are approaching an abyss, that progress is not positive. So, it depends on which direction you are going. The only progress is if, individually in our lives or as a society, we are progressing toward the good, toward what is good objectively, what is true, and what is beautiful. These three characteristics are given by God, inscribed in human nature and in nature itself: what is true, what is good, and what is beautiful. This is the natural law which God gave to human nature, and then His commandments are true. The commandments of God lead us to happiness, to true, lasting happiness. Therefore, only those measures and signs which bring us closer to or strengthen us in truth and goodness, and remind us of our last aim, to which we are going and for which we were created, eternal life, eternity, eternal happiness with God after this life, are true progress. Only progress that helps us more easily achieve this aim, our true aim of eternity, eternal life, and pleasing God, will be true progress. All other signs, even good ones, such as technological achievements today, if they do not help us come closer to God, will not truly help us.
Mark: That’s very well put. When I think about progress, especially as you wrote about it in The Springtime That Never Came, I think about the Garden of Eden. I thought, you know, it must have seemed like we were about to progress, that we were going to be as gods, and that we would achieve progress, quote. And the result of that is the same as it always is: you end up sitting in ashes and bones. We seem to be in an age obsessed with progress as a watchword, but it very often doesn’t mean that. That is particularly true in a world that sees the only path to human happiness as uninhibited sexual license and nothing else. Nothing else will bring a human being happiness. You talk a lot about that in your book. What do you make of a world that is, I would say, obsessed in a very strange way with sexual license? What is an authentic Catholic way to look at our sexual faculties as gifts from God, and how do we respond to a world that sees perversion, death, and destruction as good things? How can we, as Catholics, evangelize to that world?
Bishop Schneider: Well, first, maybe we can start with natural law, with nature, and nature is created by God. So, God created our sexuality not for the devil and not for self-indulgence. This is a work of creation, and what God created is good and beautiful. But the problem with sexuality is the wrong use of something good. It can be something good, but when you use it in the wrong way, it can be damaging. The most basic example is our freedom. God gave us the faculty of freedom to choose. This shows our dignity, that we are created in the image of God. But Adam and Eve abused the faculty of freedom by choosing evil instead of good. Therefore, the problem with sexuality is that it is abused, oftentimes by people, and also because of Original Sin, which we inherit from our first parents, Adam and Eve.
This faculty given by God, sexuality, is deeply wounded in itself. This is called concupiscence. It is a tendency against reason to use this faculty against reason and in an improper way, not in a measured way. This is concupiscence. In the area of sexuality, concupiscence is an expression of selfishness, egoism centered only on oneself, only wanting something for yourself. This is the problem with sexuality: it is wounded.
Today, even within the Church, there is a spreading of the heresy of Pelagianism, which says we are not wounded, that our nature is okay, and that everything we feel, even our sexuality, is always good. But it is not always good. It is wounded, and therefore, we have to control it and have discipline, like a horse. When a wild horse is running, if you are on the horse, you have to discipline it; otherwise, it will carry you in directions you don’t want, or even slow you down. So sexuality is like a horse we have to discipline it. When you discipline a good horse, it can do a lot of good things for you, but you have to train and discipline it.
The problem is that human beings often do not want to discipline their sexuality. We have to recognize our humility; we are wounded. God gave us reason and freedom. Of course, this force is so strong that it cannot be ultimately disciplined without the grace of God, without God’s help. Therefore, God gave us His help. He is so merciful. People abuse this gift of God because it is connected to life-giving. Sexuality is always connected to life, to giving life, not to having something only for oneself. This is contrary to true sexuality. Sexuality is given by God, planned and designed as a faculty always connected to life-giving. Therefore, any use of sexuality outside the context and frame of God, which is life-giving only in a valid marriage and family that God established, is contrary to God’s will and therefore grievously wrong. Marriage is the place to transmit life and to exercise the faculty God gave us. All acts outside the use of sexuality within a valid marriage are contrary to God’s will and grievously bad.
And even within a valid marriage, this faculty can be abused by misconceptions or other tricks to seek pleasure without the direct connection to life. So this is the way, and then you will be happy when, even in this, it is with God’s help that we can manage. Therefore, God gave us this help. The saints say, the Church prays: when you have no strength, pray to God with confidence and patience, and He will give it to you. Sometimes it is necessary to use special measures, such as penance, fasting, or prayer, to dominate this. This is very important, and then you will be truly happy and peaceful with the grace of God, especially through the sacraments, the Holy Eucharist, confession, and devotion to Our Lady. In any case, this is a gift of God.
But today, we see an attack against God’s plan. These sins against chastity are an attack against God’s commandments and His wise plan, and ultimately, an attack against life and the holy marriage God created.
Jason: I just wanted to ask, your book speaks to so many what would be called hot-button issues or hot topics today. You mentioned earlier about freedom, and I also know that in your book, you speak about freedom of religion. It seems like there’s ecumenism run amok, that the Holy Father has, well, I don’t remember if he said it verbatim, but has made it seem like proselytizing Protestants, Muslims, or those not of the Catholic faith would be wrong, right?
So, we in the United States live in a country where people are constantly preaching freedom of religion. When it comes to that, people typically conflate things. Mark and I have talked about this. They confuse what freedom and rights are, and seem to think they are the same thing. Like, “I have the freedom, I have the right to do this,” especially when it comes to worshiping God. For people like Mark and me in the United States, where there isn’t a state religion and there is this idea of freedom of religion, what would be the appropriate response for us as Catholics? Is this something we should be against in our private lives for the sake of, I guess, unity as a country, but support public policy, saying, “Oh, we support freedom of religion”? Or should we be pushing for something more, something state-focused on the Catholic faith itself?
Bishop Schneider: Well, one thing is the principle that there is only one true religion; there cannot be two or three. This is the Catholic faith, and God asks and demands of every human being on Earth to accept, of course freely, not by force, His Son, Jesus Christ, as the Savior, the only Savior and the only truth. The Church, which God established, is the way for everyone. Therefore, society as such, created by God, cannot be atheistic or neutral. That would be contrary. Even the rulers of states are creatures of God, not of the devil or something neutral. No, they are always creatures of the same God who commands the one true religion, the Catholic faith. Therefore, the state as such also has the duty to venerate its Creator. We have only one Creator. We do not have two creators, one for civil life and another for our private life. That would be Manichaeism or Gnosticism.
Therefore, as God established, all humanity must venerate God, including the state. There is only one religion; this is the truth and the principle. But since we live in a world dominated by the prince of this world, I mean the devil, and also affected by the consequences of Original Sin, God tolerates even our personal sins. God tolerates when we do wrong. He does not immediately destroy or kill us, even when people sin. God permits this in some way, but of course, at the Last Judgment, He will judge us. Still, now in His wisdom, He permits this, though He does not like or want our sins.
The same is true with religions; God permits that errors exist. Therefore, it depends on the historical circumstances. For example, in the United States, the rulers say that religion must be separated from the state and all religions must have freedom. This is in the Constitution of the United States. So, as Catholics, we cannot go directly against this because it would be unrealistic. But we must state that the principle is that there is only one religion, and states, in principle, even the President of the United States, the Senate, and Congress have to venerate God and give Him public honors. This includes Jesus Christ, to whom God is one, there is only one God, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit, the Most Holy Trinity. And to the Most Holy Trinity, even the President of the United States, as president, or the President of France, and so on, owe this honor. They have to give public honors because they are creatures of God. They cannot say, “I am not a creature of God.” They also have to worship and promote the one truth, which is the Catholic faith. This is the principle, of course. But de facto today, it’s not possible in the United States or other countries, or in Muslim or communist countries. Therefore, we have to live in such an environment, like the first Christians did when there was a pagan empire, and transmit our faith in another way, in a missionary way with love and conviction, so that slowly society will be penetrated with the truth, with the Catholic faith. But if there is a country where the majority are Catholics, the overwhelming majority, it is simply a question of justice, natural justice, that the government representing the majority of the population should also profess and show publicly the Catholic faith.
Jason: So, what I’m gathering from that is, many politicians and even some within the hierarchy try to say you can basically live a double life. But what you’re saying here is, as Catholics, even in countries where the Catholic faith is not the majority, we need to live out that principle in every aspect of our lives. We don’t need to make that separation like many are leading us to believe is the right thing to do, right? I know that when I came into the Church, when I converted back in 2018, I’ve heard about this real big push for universalism, like it doesn’t matter what you believe, everybody’s good as long as you’re a good person or whatever. So I know for us, it makes it hard as lay Catholics to evangelize and teach people when some within the Church are undermining you by going behind and telling people it doesn’t matter what God you serve, it’s all the same. Your book brings that clarity. Going back to what you just said, there’s only one God, and that’s the principle we need to live our lives on.
Bishop Schneider: Exactly. This behavior of some churchmen undermines the truth, and it undermines the entire Gospel. Jesus Christ said, “I am the only way, the only door, the gate. There is no other. All who came before me are robbers and thieves.” He is the only shepherd and pastor. He said to the apostles, “Go to all nations,” so inclusively the Jewish people, Muslims, Buddhists, Hindus, to all, without exception, and proclaim the Gospel, the revelation of God, and teach them. So it is a teaching, and teach them to observe all I have spoken and commanded, not only spoken but commanded, with love. This is the task first for the hierarchy, but every Catholic and layperson must have the desire to preach the truth and transmit it to all who are not believers, not Catholics. Because when you are convinced that this is the only truth and that this is the only thing that truly makes you happy here on Earth, you cannot simply say, “Oh, I will keep this for me.” This would be egoistic. It would be a lack of love for your neighbor, and God will judge you one day for why you kept this treasure only for yourself like in the parable in the Gospel, when the Lord gave three servants different amounts of money: to one, ten coins; to another, five coins; and the last one kept his money only for himself, and then he was judged. The same will be for us. Therefore, we have the obligation, according to our possibilities, where we live, and our state of life, to transmit this truth to those who do not have it. So we have to say again and again that there is only one truth. They cannot have the same truth at the same time because the first commandment of God is always valid: You shall not have other gods, other cults, or other worship besides Me. This is valid, and the entire Gospel is the same. Jesus Christ said, “There is no other way.” St. Paul writes that whoever does not believe in Jesus Christ, the Son of God, will be condemned, and the wrath of God will remain upon everyone who does not believe in Jesus Christ. This is St. Paul, and this is Holy Scripture, the word of the Holy Spirit.
Mark: Indeed. Well, I’ve always felt that the sin of Freemasonry was about this: their idea is that it doesn’t really matter what religion you are. I don’t think any Muslims believe that. Of course not. So to say all religions are the same is only possible if they’re all wrong. Because if two religions believe mutually exclusive things, they can both be wrong, but only one can be right. I’ve always felt this when people ask, “What’s the big deal with Freemasonry? Why is it such a big deal?” It’s the way they talk about freedom of religion as if it doesn’t matter what religion you belong to. I want to pivot for a moment to another section of the book that was very poignant and powerful, and it changed the way I looked at this subject, which is priestly celibacy. There are a lot of well-meaning Catholics, not modernists, who look at priestly celibacy and say it’s a discipline, not a doctrinal matter. Maybe it is time to do away with mandatory celibacy in the Roman Rite. Maybe that would be beneficial to the Church. And as well-meaning and well-intentioned as these individuals are, it’s not a complete way to look at this subject. I feel like the way you talked about it in the chapter was incredibly helpful because I myself have struggled at least explaining or talking about this issue. So, what would you say to someone who is a well-meaning, well-intentioned Catholic who says, “Hey, it’s a discipline. Maybe it’s time for it to change, and maybe the Church would benefit from that somehow.”? What would be your response?
Bishop Schneider: It is not only discipline. It is discipline, yes, but also apostolic tradition so old and so deeply rooted in the example of our Lord Himself and the apostles that the Church has no right, no Pope, no council, to abolish priestly celibacy de facto. I say “de facto” because when they introduce so-called facultative celibacy, or celibacy by choice, it amounts to a de facto abolition.
There are traditions touching discipline, but which are apostolic, and the Church cannot forbid or undermine them. For example, infant baptism: it is not explicitly commanded in the Gospel to baptize infants, but it is an apostolic tradition. Imagine if a Pope or council came along and said, “Let us change this, since it’s only a disciplinary matter, and establish a new rule that baptism can only be administered to children once they reach the age of reason,” say, six or seven years old when they start school, instead of infants. I think the Church would not have the authority to establish such a new rule abolishing infant baptism because it would be against the tradition of the apostles.
In the same way, I believe priestly celibacy is so deeply rooted in Scripture and divine revelation that the Church cannot simply reduce it to a disciplinary question. As I said, God gave this rule even in the Old Testament. It is divinely given, not merely disciplinary.
In the Old Testament, priests serving at the temple had to be celibate, at least during their service. When they were not exercising their priestly duties, they could live a marital life with their wives. This was a rule given by God, not by human tradition. Our Lord Jesus Christ established the new priesthood, the fulfillment and perfection of the Old Testament priesthood. Therefore, sexual continence during the exercise of the priesthood is always required in the New Testament. The priest is a priest forever according to the order of Melchizedek. He is always celebrating the Holy Mass and administering the sacraments.
This is also reflected, in some way, in the Eucharist. Even the Orthodox and Oriental churches, which abolished mandatory celibacy in the seventh century and departed from the older apostolic tradition, still maintain the rule that a priest must observe sexual continence the night before celebrating Holy Mass. So, at least when celebrating Mass, the priest must be sexually continent. But the Catholic priest celebrates Holy Mass every day and administers the sacraments regularly. Therefore, he must live continuously in continence, virginity, chastity, and celibacy. This is logical, because Jesus Christ is the High Priest, and the priest is the alter Christus, the second Christ. Christ was virginal and offered His sacrifice virginally. Therefore, the priest must visibly reflect the priesthood of Christ in this way.
Historically, the most effective missionary periods and works in the history of the Church were led by celibate priests, monks, and bishops. If you look at 2,000 years of Church history, the greatest missionaries were celibate, whether religious priests or monks, or bishops.
Mark: When you look at it this way, priestly celibacy doesn’t seem like a burden; it is a beautiful expression of a life of service, a life lived in imitation of Christ. That’s why I said, when I read that chapter in your book, it opened the subject up to me in a way I had never seen before. It recommitted me to a defense of priestly celibacy, perhaps in a way I wasn’t before. And for that, I will be eternally grateful.
Bishop Schneider: I would add a small story from my travels, which I already included in the book. Once, while traveling by train here in Kazakhstan, my seatmate was an older, very devout Muslim man. You know, they can have up to four wives, right? I was dressed as a priest, and he recognized me as a Catholic priest. He asked me, “Do Catholic priests have to observe celibacy?” I said, “Yes.” Then he asked, “For how long? How many years? How many days?” I replied, “No, it’s not a question of days or years, it’s forever, for life.” He said, “Oh, I didn’t know that.”
It was very strange to me how this Muslim man could have up to four wives whenever he wanted, and yet, as a Catholic priest, I could not have even one wife. He said, “I pity you.” Then he asked, “Can you explain this to me?”
I thought carefully about how to explain to this Muslim man, who, like the Prophet Muhammad, followed a tradition allowing multiple wives, that our celibacy was a completely different calling. I said to him, “We are celibate all our lives because we are not married; this allows us to be completely free and dedicated to God and to souls, day and night. We are always available 24 hours a day, fully free to dedicate ourselves to God and to the people.”
He listened carefully and then said, “Oh, what a beautiful way of life.” He was an older man with a sincere heart, and I will never forget his words. A Muslim praised the celibate life, this constant availability to God and to souls. That definition of celibacy, given by a Muslim man, touched me deeply.
Jason: While we’re on this subject, I want to add something personal. About a week before I read this chapter in your book, Mark and I had a conversation about celibacy. I had always supported celibacy, but wasn’t sure if it was a hill worth dying on. We exchanged text messages, and I mentioned this to him. We started reading St. Paul’s letters where he talks about “the husband of one wife,” and then we explored what the Church Fathers like St. John Chrysostom and St. Basil said on the subject. Their explanations made the issue clearer, but it was your book that truly struck a chord with me.
When you wrote about how Jesus offered His sacrifice continentally, and then connected that to the priest offering the Sacrifice of the Mass, representing Christ to God while also living in continence, that was a revelation. It was like God’s answer to my questions. I realized this truly is a hill worth dying on, something of utmost importance, not just a mere discipline. Your historical and theological insights hammered this home for me in a way nothing else has.
Mark: I’ve often told people that, in the whole Catholic Church, there really is only one true priest. When they ask me what I mean by that, I explain: Jesus Christ is the one true Priest of the Church. Monsignor Athanasius, Father Van Fleet at our parish, and all priests, through the sacrament of Holy Orders, participate in Jesus’s priesthood. So it makes perfect sense that they should, in every possible way, strive to conform themselves to Him to be alter Christus. That explanation is so beautiful and profound, and I really want to thank you for articulating it so well.
Now, shifting gears a bit, I want to talk about the current state of the Catholic Church, which can be a difficult subject. Lately, I see the world as a place at war with categorization. We’re told we can’t make distinctions anymore, like saying “that’s a man” or “that’s a woman,” or “that’s a dog,” or “that’s a tree.” It feels like we aren’t even allowed to say what things are. So, I find it puzzling when the Vatican often points to rigidity as the principal problem in the world today. What do you think is really meant by this criticism of rigidity? Is rigidity truly the problem we face today?
Bishop Schneider: No, it’s quite the opposite. The real problem is permissiveness, allowing everything, undermining the constant truth God has given us. The accusations against so-called rigidity hide an agenda to promote relativism, to relativize Jesus Christ and divine revelation.
We have to be honest and say that those who call the faithful “rigid” for holding fast to the faith and the liturgy are, ironically, very rigid themselves, especially when it comes to opposing the traditional liturgy. Their strict control over traditions and customs shows a kind of intolerance and rigidity.
And it’s not just in faith matters. These same people are extremely rigid about finances, personal accounts, wages, and salaries; they watch every small cent closely. They’re also rigid about obeying traffic laws. And rightly so: without some order, roads would be even more dangerous. But the spiritual life, the true and lasting life, also requires order and obedience to God’s rules. Ignoring those rules leads to spiritual accidents, even disasters. So rigidity in spiritual matters is not a problem; it’s necessary to protect souls and guide the faithful safely. This undermining of the truth of the faith weakens belief and opens the door to heresies and confusion. This is the real danger.
So when Pope Francis speaks about “rigidity,” his words can be very ambiguous. We must remember: when we faithfully transmit what is good, true, and beautiful, this transmission cannot be called rigidity. It is a blessing, a gift for the next generation. How can one be accused of rigidity when simply protecting and passing on truth, beauty, and holiness? It’s impossible.
Think of a father protecting his home and family. If he is strict about not letting thieves or corrupting influences enter, is he rigid? No, he is fulfilling his duty. He must guard his home and children with firmness.
Similarly, the Church, its Pope and bishops must act as vigilant fathers, defending their spiritual family from wolves who, under the guise of avoiding rigidity, try to let everyone in, regardless of the harm they might bring.
No responsible family father would allow that. Even those who criticize “rigidity” in others would not open their own homes to just anyone.
Mark: Now, regarding a thoughtful question from one of our listeners:
“Your Excellency, at this point in the pontificate, the credibility of the papacy feels very attacked. Many Catholics are unsure about what they are supposed to believe, given the confusing speeches and writings of the Pope. Because of a lack of solid catechesis and teaching over the last fifty years, there is a serious lack of supernatural faith among many clergy, and the laity is not inspired. Our parish with the FSSP Mass offers a small dose of sanity and peace that we can’t find elsewhere. The rest of the week is filled with confusion, uncertainty, and dismay brought by the father of lies. I’m not sure if I have a specific question, but do you have any words of encouragement or hope for the faithful in these times?”
Bishop Schneider: We must always hold a supernatural perspective because the Church is not merely a human institution; it is a divine-human reality. Ultimately, the Church is in the hands of Christ, not simply in the hands of the Pope. No matter how difficult or confusing the present times may be, Christ’s promise remains: “I am with you always, until the end of the age” (Matthew 28:20). The Church will endure, sustained by the Holy Spirit, through every storm.
Therefore, hold fast to the supernatural faith, to prayer, the sacraments, and the true teachings of the Church. Trust in God’s providence. This is the source of peace, hope, and true courage.
It is important to remember that the Church is ultimately in the hands of Christ. The Pope is not the successor of Christ; he is only the Vicar of Christ. Thanks be to God for that. Yes, the Pope is the Vicar, and God permits this. So we must simply say, “O Lord, You permit that I live in such a confused time, when even the Pope spreads ambiguities and sometimes undermines truth.”
It is difficult when the Supreme Shepherd, or my bishop, or a priest causes confusion. Yet, if God permits this, it has a meaning for me because God is wise. He allows evil only to bring about a greater good. What is that greater good for me? It is that I am strengthened in my faith. I will keep the faith I have known from the Catechism, from the lives of the saints. I have the Eucharist, the living Lord is present in the tabernacle, in the Holy Host. He is there, alive, with all His powerful majesty. There, I will go to Him.
I will pray for the Pope and for all the shepherds that they may regain the truth and strength. I pray that God will send courageous, apostolic men to the Chair of Peter, to the other episcopal chairs, and to the priesthood. He will do this because this is His Church, it is not ours. This is a time of trials for me, so I accept it with humility. The Lord will reward me in eternity with greater rewards because I lived through such a difficult time. God is so good; He will give us eternal rewards precisely because we have passed through such a trial. No prayer we offer is in vain. We must pray for a new pope, for new bishops, and offer our sacrifices in a spirit of penance and trust.
We must also remember the parable of the field, where Our Lord said the Church is the field to be sown, and among the wheat is also the chaff. This applies even to the hierarchy among bishops, cardinals, priests, and even the papacy itself. It is not spared from this. Sometimes God permits this. Thanks be to God, because in the history of the Church, the overwhelming majority of popes have been good shepherds and saints, courageous men. But sometimes, not.
So, this is the parable of the wheat and the chaff, and the same goes for the Episcopacy, the priesthood, and the faithful. But the field is the Lord’s field, and there is still wheat. We must trust and pray, for the Church is invincible. Our Lord promised that the gates of hell would not prevail against the Church. This is a trial for us, and we must believe in this truth. Despite the confusion coming from the visible center of the Church in Rome, this confusion is temporary. It is only a passing moment, and the Church will rise again. Rome will again shine brightly.
Mark: That was beautiful, truly good. I don’t know about you, Jason, but I’m ready to run through a brick wall after hearing that. Before we wrap up, I wanted to quickly ask about Our Lady’s role in all of this. What does devotion to Our Blessed Mother mean in terms of our fight against evil, especially in these challenging times?
Bishop Schneider: Yes, Our Lady is the most powerful because she is immaculate, pure, and most filled with God. She is the closest to God and the most humble creature. God gave to the most humble and pure His power to crush the head of the devil, the serpent. She does this with all her humility, beauty, and purity.
In motherly love, she is our mother not to forget, she is the Mother of the Church, the most loving mother, and also the most powerful mother. Therefore, the Church has venerated her throughout the centuries as the one who defeated and conquered all heresies. This is a title of Our Lady. She is also the “acies ordinata,” the well-ordered battle formation. She is our Queen, our captain, our commander. Of course, we have St. Michael the Archangel, but St. Michael is the servant of Our Lady. She is the Queen of Angels.
So we have a very powerful army, and we must be conscious and aware fighters. The Lord gave us Our Lady, our mother, who comes to help when her children are in danger. But we have to invoke her.
God gave to our time a special devotion through Our Lady of Fatima: the devotion to the Immaculate Heart of Mary, the consecration, and the Rosary. This is the will of God, as Our Lady told us in Fatima. I encourage people to make more chains of rosaries. Recently, Blessed Pauline Jaricot was beatified. She was a French virgin in the 19th century who founded the Society for the Propagation of the Faith and the so-called Living Rosary, a group of 15 persons, each taking a mystery of the Rosary. Fifteen because it symbolizes the 150 Psalms of the Holy Scripture.
The Rosary is the Marian Psalter, a symbol of 150 Hail Marys, like the 150 Psalms. So we should encourage forming these groups, each person praying one mystery for a specific intention, for example, for the Church to receive a new courageous, 100% Catholic pope who will defend the faith and uphold holy tradition as Peter and the holy popes did in history.
God will hear Our Lady, our loving mother. The Rosary is the most powerful means God has given us in these days. I would encourage everyone to pray it.
Jason: You know, I noticed when you were speaking about Mary, all three of us were smiling at the same time.
Mark: I usually lead the Rosary at Mass, and I always add a special intention for the intercession of Our Lady of Guadalupe for the protection of human life. I never thought much about it, but then recently, when the Supreme Court overturned Roe v. Wade, it made me realize never to discount Our Lady. She is working. God is working.
Bishop Schneider: Exactly.
I want to thank you for inviting me. I hope the listeners benefit from this discussion. It’s a blessing to see young families and young men committed to the faith; it’s a sign of the Holy Spirit awakening in the Church.
I bless you both and all your families. May God bless you abundantly, and may from your families come holy priests.
Host:
If we could ask one favor, would you be willing to impart the apostolic blessing to us and our listeners?
Bishop Schneider: With great pleasure.
Dóminus vobíscum.
Mark and Jason: Et cum spíritu tuo.
Bishop Schneider:Descéndat super vos benedíctio Dei omnipoténtis, Patris, et Fílii, et Spíritus Sancti, et máneat semper. Amen.
Host: Thank you so much, Your Excellency. And thank you for your wonderful book, The Springtime That Never Came, available at Sophia Press, and we’ll link it in the description. This book is truly bread for our souls, especially now, just like Our Lord said about a father giving bread to his children, not stones. Thank you for your time, your blessing, and for standing strong in the faith. May God continue to bless and protect you.
Bishop Schneider: God bless you all.