The Auxiliary Bishop of Astana, Bishop Athanasius Schneider, a guest on Raymond Arroyo’s program, gave an interview on May 15 to EWTN, the world’s largest Catholic television network, which broadcasts in more than 160 countries and reaches more than 435 million homes.
Throughout this interview, Bishop Schneider made a very clear defense of the Society of Saint Pius X against the threats of excommunication brandished again by Rome on May 13 regarding the future episcopal consecrations of July 1.
The bishop also delivered a firm critique of the report of Study Group No. 9 of the Synod on Synodality, which he openly accuses of promoting homosexual ideology at the very heart of the official structures of the Vatican.
On several occasions, Bishop Schneider contrasted the severity displayed against Tradition with the great tolerance shown today towards progressive currents and doctrinal deviations.
A Un-Catholic Text
The interview begins with a question about the final report of Study Group No. 9 of the Synod, recently published in the Vatican. Bishop Schneider replies: “When you read the entire text, it becomes clear that it was not written by a Catholic, nor even by a Christian. It is a propaganda text, which very carefully and cunningly uses certain traditional documents or biblical expressions, but which fundamentally aims to promote the acceptance of homosexual ideology.”
Bishop Schneider asserts that this ideology constitutes “a denial of the order of creation, and even a revolt against the beautiful, divinely established order of the two sexes. There are not three sexes. This is God’s commandment and God’s wisdom.”
The Holy See document “provides a platform and even invites people living in same-sex unions to spread their propaganda.”
The interview continued, focusing on the doctrinal content of the report. Bishop Schneider explained that he had read the entire text carefully. His first observation was the complete absence of any mention of Christian conversion: “There isn’t a word about repentance. How could this be a Catholic and Christian text, when the first words of the incarnate God addressed to all humanity are: ‘Repent’? That is the message of salvation and hope.”
He continues: “There is no word on repentance. There is no word on chastity. It is absent. In the text, there isn’t even a word on conversion. The only meaning given to conversion concerns human relationships: a ‘relational conversion.’ But conversion to God is absent, even though it is the fundamental path of the Gospel of salvation.”
Bishop Schneider therefore considers this text to be: “a highly ideological document, which promotes a new religion of man, clearly anthropocentric. And they even dare to declare in this document that the sources of Revelation include human experience. This is heresy.”
The Vatican Is Signaling That It Accepts Same-sex Unions
The journalist points out that the document was presented as historic by Fr. James Martin and some progressive circles.
Bishop Schneider acknowledges that the text is not technically a magisterial document. But he immediately adds that “nevertheless, it was published by a body of the Holy See, the Secretariat of the Synod.” He continues, “The majority of ordinary Catholics are unaware of the distinctions between a magisterial text, a Vatican text, and a study group document.”
Therefore: “This message given to the whole world and to Catholics is that, from now on, the Holy See, the Vatican, fundamentally accepts, in fact, same-sex relationships, homosexual activity and the so-called LGBTQ agenda, which is a non-Christian global ideology.”
One of the most striking passages of the interview concerns a sentence in the report claiming that the sin in homosexual relationships lies not in the relationship itself but in a lack of faith. Bishop Schneider completely rejects this: “That’s false. It’s heresy, because a homosexual relationship is contrary to God’s commandments. It is a sin in itself.”
He continued: “To claim that sin does not consist in same-sex relationships is contrary to the truth revealed by God, contrary to experience, contrary to common sense. And then to say that sin consists in a lack of faith is reminiscent of Martin Luther, who said: sola fide; have only faith and trust, and do not concern yourself with your sins or your actions. This is not Catholic at all.”
The journalist then mentions the attempt by the Synod Secretariat to distance itself from the report by explaining that the study groups work independently.
Bishop Schneider completely dismisses this explanation: “It’s not convincing at all. This report is officially under a Vatican dicastery or body called the Synod Secretariat. It has even been officially published. Of course, they say it’s a study group, but that’s just a ruse to close our eyes, while simultaneously transmitting and providing a propaganda platform for this homosexual ideology, in order to further infect the Catholic Church through the acceptance of this lifestyle.”
The Consecrations of July 1st
The interview then turns to the upcoming episcopal consecrations of the Society of Saint Pius X. The journalist recalls that Cardinal Víctor Manuel Fernández has officially declared that the consecrations planned for July 1st would constitute a schismatic act leading to excommunication.
Bishop Schneider immediately replied: “I believe they will carry out the consecration project. But I do not agree with the assertion that it would be schismatic.”
The bishop then referred to the recent doctrinal declaration published by Fr. Davide Pagliarani, Superior General of the Society of Saint Pius X: “When you read it, it is entirely Catholic. It is written with such devotion to the Holy Father. They say: ‘We only want to be, Holy Father, your good sons of the Roman Catholic Church.'”
He continues: “They acknowledge the Pope’s full authority, his jurisdiction, his teaching, and ask him: ‘Please, strengthen us in this Catholic Faith which we profess.’ And what they profess is the constant doctrine of the Church. All the points they list in this declaration are nothing other than what the Church has always professed, always.”
Bishop Schneider then develops a historical and canonical argument: “In the traditional view, in the long-standing view of the Church, disobedience to the Pope, even in the case of an illicit episcopal consecration, has never been considered by Church tradition as schismatic in itself. In ancient canon law, an illicit episcopal consecration against the will of the Pope was punished only by suspension, and not by excommunication. It was therefore not considered in itself to be schismatic.”
The bishop emphasized the Society’s stated intention: “The Society has written to Pope Leo on several occasions and explained publicly, as well as in February in Rome to Cardinal Fernández, that it does not wish to establish a parallel hierarchy. It will not grant these bishops any jurisdiction, but only the possibility of administering the sacraments of Holy Orders and Confirmation, nothing more. The intention is therefore clear: there is no schismatic intent. They even wish to collaborate with the Pope and ask him to allow these ordinations. They simply want the guarantee of transmitting the eternal faith without any ambiguity or compromise.”
Ambiguities in the Council and the Post-Conciliar Magisterium
The journalist then mentions the possibility for the Society of Saint Pius X to follow the model of the Society of St. Peter.
Bishop Schneider replied: “The problem is deeper. There are ambiguities in certain texts of the Council. There are ambiguities in the post-conciliar Magisterium. The Fraternity of Saint Peter, for its part, does not have the possibility—the Holy See forbids it—of expressing criticism, even constructive criticism. It must accept all these teachings of the Council and the post-conciliar Magisterium. That is a problem.”
Bishop Schneider, on the contrary, believes that the Society of Saint Pius X renders a genuine service to the Church: “There are ambiguities. We must address them. We must be honest. And that is why we must be grateful to the Society of Saint Pius X for addressing them publicly. We must have, within the Church, the freedom to discuss.“
Bishop Schneider compares Rome’s current attitude towards the Society of Saint Pius X with the great tolerance shown towards other situations: “At the same time, while Pope Leo and the Vatican promote the inclusiveness of the synodal path, of synodal methods, while they are generous with the German Synodal Way, generous with the Chinese Communist Party by allowing it to ordain bishops there, the contrast is immense. And these faithful of the Society of Saint Pius X, who love the Pope, who pray for the Pope, who simply want the guarantee of transmitting the faith of all time without any ambiguity—I insist: without any ambiguity—are being denied this, and now they are being punished.”
Bishop Schneider then quotes Saint Basil during the Arian crisis: “The only crime that is punished in our time is fidelity to the faith and traditions of our fathers, while all blasphemy has free rein in the Church.”
Bishop Schneider concluded by warning that a possible excommunication of the Society of Saint Pius X would be a stain on the history of the Church: “I think that if the Pope does this, if he does not grant them this permission and excommunicates them, it will remain in history as a huge error of rigidity, of pastoral rigidity, and of unilateral severity towards Tradition in the Church.”
Finally, the bishop addressed a solemn appeal to Pope Leo XIV: “Holy Father, please, avoid such a wound in the Church. You can avoid it.”