Transcript:
The Simple Truth is rising up to explore the difficult topics of real life. Join us as we proclaim the good, the true, and the beautiful with the simple truth of Jesus Christ and His Holy Catholic Church through Scripture, Tradition, and the Catechism.
And now, your host, Jim Hales.
Jim Havens: It is great to be back with you on The Simple Truth, where we proclaim the life-giving reality of Jesus and His Catholic Church. We consecrate everything to the Sacred Heart of Jesus through the Immaculate Heart of Mary and the pure, strong Heart of Saint Joseph.
It is Current Events Wednesday, and our guest today is Bishop Athanasius Schneider. He is one of the foremost defenders of the Catholic faith in our time. He serves as Auxiliary Bishop of the Archdiocese of Saint Mary in Astana, Kazakhstan. He is Chairman of the Liturgical Commission as well as Secretary General of the Conference of Catholic Bishops of Kazakhstan. He is also a prolific author, and we’ll be talking about his very important new book today, The Catholic Mass: Steps to Restore the Centrality of God in the Liturgy. It’s published by Sophia Institute Press, sophiainstitute.com.
His Excellency, Bishop Athanasius Schneider, thank you for being with us today. How are you?
Bishop Athanasius Schneider: Thank you.
Jim Hales: Alright, it’s great to have you with us. Bishop, would you mind leading us in an opening prayer?
Bishop Athanasius Schneider: Yes.
In nomine Patris et Filii et Spiritus Sancti. Amen.
Pater Noster, qui es in caelis, sanctificetur nomen tuum, adveniat regnum tuum, fiat voluntas tua, sicut in caelo et in terra. Panem nostrum quotidianum da nobis hodie, et dimitte nobis debita nostra, sicut et nos dimittimus debitoribus nostris. Et ne nos inducas in tentationem, sed libera nos a malo. Amen.
Gloria Patri, et Filio, et Spiritui Sancto, Sicut erat in principio, et nunc, et semper, et in saecula saeculorum. Amen.
In nomine Patris et Filii et Spiritus Sancti. Amen.
Jim Havens: Amen. Alright, thank you, Bishop.
This is an outstanding book in so many ways. The Catholic Mass that we’re going to be talking about today. We have so much to get to, but first, it is important that we always begin on this Current Events Wednesday show by remembering the biggest current event of all, and the number one news story that ought to be reported on by all the networks but is going unreported today and every day and that is the ongoing, daily, government-sanctioned, government-funded, government-protected mass murder of innocent children in the wombs of their mothers. Real people are being murdered by the thousands today and every day in our nation. This also means the mass exploitation of pregnant moms in need for profit by the lie of abortion.
In terms of loss of human life, we have at least a 9/11 every day in the US. Imagine 3,000 of any other category of persons being murdered in a given day in our nation, and it going unreported by the media and even mostly ignored by the churches. Then imagine if that were happening every day, and you begin to understand something of the insane reality in which we find ourselves.
According to a July 2020 article in the prestigious peer-reviewed medical journal The Lancet, we have a global death toll from abortion of 73.3 million children annually, which is more than 200,000 preborn children being murdered worldwide every day.
It is essential that we put great effort into breaking through our own desensitization to this massive evil. We have to face reality on this and so much more. We must live, proclaim, and push forward the vision that every innocent human being, without exception, has a right to life. Even an atheist still ought to have the basic moral sense to see the evil of killing an innocent child.
For those who believe in Jesus and His Catholic Church, we have the additional benefit of crystal-clear, authoritative magisterial teaching on this, which truly gives us absolutely no place to hide in treating those in the womb as any less valuable than us.
Catechism of the Catholic Church 2270: “Human life must be respected and protected absolutely from the moment of conception, meaning fertilization. From the first moment of his existence, a human being must be recognized as having the rights of a person, among which is the inviolable right of every innocent human being to life.” End of quote.
Also, if you’ve experienced abortion in some way as a mother, father, sibling, grandparent, etc., there are some great people and great resources available to help you in your healing process. We love you. You are not alone. Go to lovewillendchildkilling.com, click on the healing tab for more information.
Your Excellency, Bishop Athanasius Schneider, thank you for your patience during that introduction. I want to connect it with your new book, The Catholic Mass. As we begin here, you write that “The liturgical reform has favored a certain liturgical relativism, which has also led to a doctrinal relativism.”
You also quote Cardinal Viterbo during the inaugural oration of the Fifth Lateran Council in 1512: “Men must be changed by sacred things, and not sacred things by men.” End of quote.
Do you see a connection between the liturgical permissiveness of bishops and the lack of defense of the sacred in the Holy Mass over the past 50 years that has led to the widespread loss of faith, and the moral permissiveness of bishops and lack of defense of the sacredness of human life, that has led to the greatest manifestation of evil in our time perhaps even of all time in the ongoing, daily mass murder of the preborn, truly the least of the least of these, by abortion?
Bishop Athanasius Schneider: Yes, there is a connection between the faith, the clarity of faith, the holy worship, the liturgy, and our moral life. In Latin, it is said: Lex credendi, the law of faith, of believing. Then lex orandi, the law of prayer, liturgy. And lex vivendi, the law of life, is how we live. All three are connected.
Therefore, when we introduce the principle of relativism into the liturgy, and relativism ultimately means anthropocentrism, then the human being decides what is true. This is reflected in the manner of worship, when the celebrant and the community are centered upon themselves in a community-centered, anthropocentric manner of worship.
Over time, this influences the manner of thinking, so that even regarding truth, it becomes man-centered. We have experienced this in the last decades since the so-called liturgical reform. In so many churches around the world, we have seen relativism in worship. In almost every parish, you could discover a different style, a different manner of celebrating, depending on the celebrant or the community.
This relativism in liturgy is not comparable with the tradition of the ancient Church, where there was a richness of different liturgical forms or rites. That richness had something in common: the faithful observance of all liturgical norms, a strictly theocentric and Christocentric manner of liturgy, and the sublimity and sacredness of every detail in the liturgy. These were the common elements in all traditional liturgical rites that the Catholic Church has possessed since the first centuries, historical and still-valid rites, especially in the Oriental churches.
For example, the Byzantine rite, the Armenian, the Coptic, the Ethiopic, the Syrian, and others. All of these have in common the elements and rules I mentioned. This is the key difference compared to the current new liturgical reform, the new rite we now have in the Latin Church. In the new Mass, the rules of faithful observance, being centered on God, being God-oriented during prayer, the sacredness and sublimity of all the rites, even in the details, are very much lacking. And this leads to relativism and anthropocentrism.
Jim Havens: Yes, very good. As we get going into this interview, we’re going to break all of this open for folks. We’re certainly not going to be able to get to everything that is in the book, but we do have Bishop Athanasius Schneider here with us today to discuss his new book, The Catholic Mass: Steps to Restore the Centrality of God in the Liturgy.
We’re about to hit a hard break in just a moment, but when we come back, we are going to talk with Bishop Schneider about the Protestantization of the Eucharistic rite. We’re going to get into some of the history to understand why we are where we are, and also to understand the clues that help us correct our course, to be able to get to where God is drawing us to be.
Now, I do want to say a word about this book again. You can get it at sophiainstitute.com. Published by Sophia Institute Press. Highly, highly recommend this book. It will help you understand the Catholic Mass more deeply, understand the richness that we have in the Mass. It goes through so many aspects of the Mass. It is tremendously beautiful, refreshing, and orienting, helping us see where we are and where we need to go. I want to emphasize the centrality of the Sacrifice of the Mass. If we can get that, if we can get that, then we can enter into that sacrifice all the more. And I think we will go out to our least of the least brothers and sisters in the world who need us all the more.
We’ll be right back. Stay tuned.
Prayer of Deliverance:
Almighty God and Father, we beg Thee through the intercession and help of the Archangels Saint Michael, Raphael, and Gabriel, for the deliverance of our brothers and sisters who are enslaved by the evil one:
From anxiety, sadness, and obsessions, we implore Thee, deliver us, O Lord.
From hatred, fornication, and envy, we implore Thee, deliver us, O Lord.
From thoughts of jealousy, rage, and death, we implore Thee, deliver us, O Lord.
From every thought of suicide and abortion, we implore Thee, deliver us, O Lord.
From every form of sinful sexuality, we implore Thee, deliver us, O Lord.
From every division in our family and every harmful friendship, we implore Thee, deliver us, O Lord.
From every sort of spell, malefice, witchcraft, and every form of the occult, we implore Thee, deliver us, O Lord.
Thou who said, “Peace I leave with you, My peace I give unto you,” Grant that through the intercession of the Virgin Mary, we may be liberated from every demonic influence and enjoy Thy peace always.
In the name of Christ, our Lord. Amen.
Announcer:
As a nonprofit lay organization, financially independent from your diocese, our apostolate is listener-supported. The Station of the Cross thanks our supporters who have enabled us to broadcast Catholic programs for more than 20 years.
Through your generosity, we are able to inspire countless listeners with the Gospel message and help lead them to a parish to be spiritually nourished by the sacraments. Thank you for your continued support, and may God bless you and your family.
Do you love listening to The Station of the Cross on your car radio, but sometimes find yourself driving outside the listening area? Never miss another minute of your favorite show. Download the iCatholicRadio app so you can listen anywhere in the world, 24 hours a day.
The iCatholicRadio app is available for your phone in the App Store or for your Android phone in Google Play. Visit thestationofthecross.com for more information.
Jim Havens: Welcome back to The Simple Truth. Jim Havens here with our guest today, Bishop Athanasius Schneider.
We are talking about his new book today, The Catholic Mass: Steps to Restore the Centrality of God in the Liturgy. It’s published by Sophia Institute Press. You can get it at sophiainstitute.com.
Bishop Schneider, you characterize much that has gone wrong in terms of the liturgical errors and abuses as a “Protestantization” of the Eucharistic rite. You explain, quote: “The Church has a 2,000-year history, and the Novus Ordo has been with us only for about 50 years. Usually, the crises in the Church have lasted about 70 years, similar to the Babylonian exile in the Old Testament, or the exile of Avignon in 14th-century France. Today, we are going through a period of liturgical exile.” End of quote.
How did we get here? It’s a big question, but briefly, in your view, what happened to bring us into this crisis, this period of liturgical exile?
Bishop Athanasius Schneider: I think we have to go back to the roots, and this is the modern crisis of the Church, which started even before the Council, the infiltration of modernism, the so-called modernism, which is essentially doctrinal relativism.
It establishes the principle that each time or era can change the meaning of truth. So, there is no everlasting, unchanging truth. This is one of the key principles of modernism. This principle also partly influenced the liturgical reform after the Council. It introduced an anthropocentric tendency, a man-centered form of worship. It became much closer to the Protestant understanding of the Eucharist. Concretely, the liturgical reform, both in its texts and in the external forms of celebration, especially the man-centered celebration, where the priest continuously looks at the people, like a kind of lecture or gathering. This shape, this form itself, gradually destroys or undermines the substantial truth of the Eucharist, of the Holy Mass, which is the sacrifice of the Cross.
The Holy Mass has been handed down by the apostles. The Church, for 2,000 years, has upheld the Holy Mass as the sacramental form of the sacrifice of Golgotha, our Redeemer’s sacrifice. It is really present on our altars in an unbloody way, but in the same truth. The substance is the same. This is the greatest work in all of history, in the entire universe, the sacrifice on the Cross. It is the greatest expression of God’s love for us, and the greatest expression of divine worship, of adoration. Christ, in His humanity, gave this adoration in the name of all humanity, of all creation, to the Most Holy Trinity.
It is the greatest expression of thanksgiving, of propitiation, of atonement, and of petition. These realities are the substance of the Holy Mass. This is the essence. It must be emphasized in the form of how we celebrate, even externally, in the texts and in the ritual actions. And this the Church did for 2,000 years. In all liturgical rites, even in the Eastern rites, since the apostles all turned together, priest and faithful, in the same direction, toward the Cross of the Lord, toward the altar, to express that we are now standing on the fruit of the Lord’s Cross, spiritually, and in a sacramental way, really as well.
From this, the fruit of the sacrifice flows, Holy Communion, the aspect of the banquet. And this is a subordinate aspect of the Holy Mass. It is an integral part, of course, but it flows out from the sacrifice. The problem with the Novus Ordo, the new Mass, is that this secondary aspect of the meal was put at the center. It was really reversed. This is contrary to the divine meaning of the Holy Eucharist, which Christ instituted as His sacramental sacrifice.
We have to restore this again. The sacrificial aspect shows very clearly that God is at the center. We are receiving from Him these fruits. The meal, the banquet, and the community-centered form are anthropocentric; we are doing something and sharing, and this does not correspond to the continuous, unchanging tradition of the Church.
Therefore, it is necessary to turn to the Lord in all churches during the Holy Mass, at least, and then, over time, also change some texts in the Novus Ordo which weaken the sacrificial character. For example, the offertory prayers the priest prays in the Novus Ordo do not express the central meaning of the Mass, the sacrificial offering of the Body and Blood of Christ, the Immaculate Victim.
These prayers instead express the meal that we will receive the Body of Christ as a meal. This is very deficient and dangerous. We have to change this. The Church will change this, I’m convinced. We must reintroduce the old, proven offertory prayers which so deeply express the meaning of the sacrifice of the Cross. We hope the Holy Spirit will guide the Church. And now we already see signs that the young generations, young seminarians, young priests, young families they are instinctively, with the sense of faith, perceiving the beauty of Catholic truth. They perceive the necessary aspects of sacrifice, of adoration, of silence, and sacredness in the Holy Mass.
Jim Havens: Yes, Bishop Athanasius Schneider is with us. We’re talking about his new book, The Catholic Mass: Steps to Restore the Centrality of God in the Liturgy.
Just as you speak so eloquently on this topic, you write about it very eloquently and beautifully in the book. One of the thoughts that continues to come to me as I read it, as I listen to you, is that regular folks like myself, my family, others I know, as we come to understand the objective truth and beauty of what the Holy Mass is, we long to adore our Lord rightly. To worship Almighty God Father, Son, and Holy Spirit rightly.
We long for a sense of reverence, of awe and wonder in response to the great beauty and truth before us, which is the greatest treasure we could ever imagine here on Earth, leading us into the eternal kingdom. So this is really what’s behind so many people looking for more reverence wherever they can find it, maybe in a reverent Novus Ordo that implements more traditional practices, or by attending the Traditional Latin Mass.
There is a hunger in man to adore our Lord rightly, isn’t there?
Bishop Athanasius Schneider: Of course, and this is a demonstration of the truth that the Christian soul, the Catholic soul, is longing for objective truth. Truth is always beauty, and beauty attracts us. There is one word in the Gospel where our Lord spoke to the Samaritan woman: “If you knew the gift of God…” We have to say the same to people, to Catholics who come to assist at Holy Mass on Sundays, especially those in Novus Ordo parishes:
If you knew the unspeakable gift of the Holy Mass, which is, first, the sacrifice of the Cross, the heavenly sacrifice, which Christ is now offering in heaven as our High Priest, offering to the Father the same sacrifice of the Cross with His glorified wounds. It is the same. So the Holy Mass is also, at the same time, the open heaven, where Christ, our High Priest, continues to intercede for us, showing to His Father His living wounds, the Lamb in heaven surrounded by the entire communion of saints and the angels. This is the reality of the Holy Mass.
If you knew this reality, what this is, you would kneel down. You would desire silence. You would desire to contemplate and be aware of this reality. This is Calvary and the open heaven. Therefore, the Church has developed and accumulated this form of celebrating the Mass, this truth, over all the centuries and millennia. The saints whom we know grew up in this form of the Holy Mass. And of course, it is always our task, even the most beautiful Mass, the most reverent and sacred Traditional Mass, will not help you if you are not prepared internally to participate. If you are not collected.
So, it is always a duty for us and for the priests first, even in the most beautiful Traditional Mass, to prepare ourselves, to be conscious and aware, to participate with faith, with love, with repentance, and with gratitude.
Jim Havens: So many important distinctions here with Bishop Athanasius Schneider. If you like what he’s saying, you’re going to love his book The Catholic Mass: Steps to Restore the Centrality of God in the Liturgy. It is incredible and much needed at this time.
He writes: “Surely divine providence will intervene and give us a hierarchy that will know how to repair the liturgy according to the sensus perennis, the perennial sense of the Church’s tradition. The new rite will then be brought back more and more to the traditional liturgical form of the Church and come close to the traditional form of the Mass. There will not be a mixture, but the two forms will be very similar.”
We’re going to get back to this in just a moment. Stay tuned.
Jim Havens: Welcome back to The Simple Truth. Jim Havens here with our guest today, Bishop Athanasius Schneider. We are talking about The Catholic Mass: Steps to Restore the Centrality of God in the Liturgy, published by Sophia Institute Press. You can get it at sophiainstitute.com.
You write in the book that: “The Sacrifice of the Mass is the true sun of the world, the spiritual lightning rod of the world, the spiritual center of the world. The Catholic Mass is irrepressible. The many external persecutions over 2,000 years have not been able to destroy it, and even the persecutions within the life of the Church today have not been able to destroy that most ancient form, the constant form, the surest and most expressively sacrificial liturgical form of the Holy Mass.”
Then later you write: “It is necessary to reintroduce into the Novus Ordo celebration of the Holy Mass many signs and gestures that were abolished, since they helped the celebrant and faithful to preserve a living and supernatural awareness that the Holy Mass is a sacred action par excellence. Thus will the Eucharistic celebration be lived in the spirit of adoration and love, in spirit and truth, as God demands,” pointing to John 4:24.
Just incredible, incredible stuff. I think this book will give great hope to many who see what’s going on currently and are looking to understand a way out how this can go in a better direction. You lay out a very good blueprint in this book of what we ought to be thinking about and what we ought to be moving toward.
Can you explain more about some of the gestures and signs, some of the aspects that need to be changed and reintroduced into the Novus Ordo to make it what it ought to be?
Bishop Athanasius Schneider: First, I would say that the current Novus Ordo is not the Mass of Vatican II. This is not correct. You cannot find in the Council texts on the liturgy the typical Novus Ordo elements.
Let us say first, celebrating with the people, like in a closed circle, there is nothing in the Vatican Council about this. On the contrary, the text of Sacrosanctum Concilium, the liturgical constitution of the Council, says the opposite. The liturgy must be such that the human is subordinated to the divine and oriented to it. That the action is subordinated to contemplation and oriented to it. That earthly realities are subordinated to the heavenly. This is how the liturgy has to be, says the Council text. Another part of the same document says that in our earthly liturgy, we must always be aware that we are participating in the heavenly liturgy.
This is the teaching of Vatican II. Also, Vatican II says that in all Catholic Masses, it is obligatory that the bishop must guarantee that all the faithful know how to sing and to pray, at least the ordinary texts of the Mass in Latin, like the Kyrie, Gloria, Sanctus, and so on. This is an obligation from the Council, but it has been completely disregarded by the bishops until now.
So, I repeat, there is a myth about Vatican II. And in the name of the Council, they introduced ruptures and Protestantizing elements which cannot be concretely justified by the Council texts. There is no word in the Council text that we must give Holy Communion in the hand.
There is no word in the Council text, not even implicitly, that women should read the readings and serve at the altar, or that laypeople should give Holy Communion, which is completely alien. There is no text [in the Council] supporting this. These practices were only introduced after the Council by a revolutionary committee in the Vatican, unfortunately, or were already introduced in disobedience in some local churches, especially in the Netherlands and Germany. So, this is the reality.
We also have to bear in mind the fact that is often forgotten: the so-called “Vatican II Mass” was the Mass of 1965. In January 1965, the Pope published a new, reformed order of the Mass, the Vatican II Mass, where the new form was very close and similar to the traditional Mass.
There was no obligation or even mention of celebrating with the people. In the Vatican II Mass of 1965, the traditional Mass remained essentially the same. The only differences were that the Psalm 42 (Judica me, Deus) at the beginning was dropped, but that was not a complete novelty. During Lent, in the last two weeks, that psalm was already omitted in the traditional form. Also, the Last Gospel, the reading from the Gospel of John at the end, was dropped. These were the only two notable changes.
The main difference was the use of vernacular language, especially in the first part of the Mass, which was allowed and promoted. But from the Preface to the Our Father, it was still obligatory in the 1965 Mass to use Latin. Also, only the Roman Canon (Eucharistic Prayer I) was used, in Latin and in silence. So, that was the true Vatican II Mass.
When the final session of the Council took place in Fall 1965, the Council Fathers returned and celebrated this reformed Mass. They agreed that this corresponded to their proposals. Only after the Council, there was a revolution, the so-called New Order Mass, which introduced Protestantizing elements.
So I think the following elements are indispensable in order to return to the Mass in the spirit of all ages:
- The priest must face the same direction as the people, toward the crucifix or the altar, during all prayers, especially during the Offertory and the Canon of the Mass. This is indispensable.
- Holy Communion must be received kneeling and on the tongue. Communion in the hand is the deepest wound in the Church. Through this practice, there is a widespread desecration of the Holy Host. Fragments of the Host are lost; no one can deny this. They stick to the fingers or palms of communicants, fall to the ground, and are trampled underfoot. It is incredible that Our Lord, in His divine majesty, in even the smallest particles of His Body and Blood, is being trampled in so many churches. We cannot continue this. This must be stopped immediately.
- Silence during the Canon of the Mass. The priest should pray it in silence, or at least in a low voice, so the faithful can have a moment of recollection and prayer. In that holy moment when Our Lord is made present through His sacrifice on the altar, the reality of Calvary is present. It must be surrounded by an atmosphere of reverence and silence.
- Only men, vested in liturgical vestments, should serve at the altar or read in the sanctuary. This is in accordance with Saint Paul’s teaching, the Fathers of the Church, and the entire tradition. It reflects the sacredness and sublime character of the Holy Mass.
- The use of Latin should be reintroduced, especially in the central parts of the Novus Ordo. This will help to unite Catholics throughout the world and to express the mystery of God and the sacrifice of the Cross. Latin has always been the sacred language preserved by the Church throughout the ages.
Jim Havens: Yes, Bishop Athanasius Schneider is with us, talking about his new book, The Catholic Mass: Steps to Restore the Centrality of God in the Liturgy, published by Sophia Institute Press. You can get it at sophiainstitute.com.
Bishop, I want to thank you for your clarity in proclaiming the truth. It really is an act of authentic charity, and I, along with many others, greatly appreciate it and benefit from it. In regard to the changes you’ve just outlined, could a regular pastor in a parish start making some of those changes? Or is that something that really needs to be led by the bishop of the diocese?
Bishop Athanasius Schneider: I think that some of these things a parish priest could indeed do because it is not forbidden to use Latin. So, a bishop cannot forbid it. On the contrary, the priest would actually be obeying the Council text, which obliges the use of Latin. There’s also a document from the Holy See from the year 2000, which states that, in the Novus Ordo, celebrating Mass facing the people is not obligatory. So the priest can celebrate ad orientem if he wishes. At the very least, the priest could begin by using more Latin.
Of course, today, Communion in the hand has been introduced in almost all countries. Unfortunately, many priests do not have the authority on their own to refuse Communion in the hand. As for celebrating ad orientem, the priest could do it; it is permitted. But in practice, I think bishops often intervene and impose their own rules. Unfortunately, this is our current situation.
We must pray that God will give us bishops who themselves introduce ad orientem celebration in their cathedrals, and who will, in their dioceses, forbid Communion in the hand. These are the kind of bishops we need more and more. But it would be even better if the Pope himself did this from Rome, then the bishops would obey. So, we must implore that the authentic renewal comes from Rome.
Jim Havens: Yes, we will keep praying. Absolutely. And I want to read this quote from The Catholic Mass by Bishop Schneider as we go into the break:
“The revival of receiving the Body of the Lord kneeling and on the tongue as a universal practice would be a visible and impressive testimony of the Church’s faith today. It could also help to heal and educate modern culture, to which kneeling and spiritual childhood are completely foreign concepts. A culture that has distanced itself from the faith and no longer knows the One before whom it must kneel.”
Jim Havens: Welcome back to The Simple Truth. Jim Havens here with Bishop Athanasius Schneider, discussing his new book: The Catholic Mass: Steps to Restore the Centrality of God in the Liturgy, published by Sophia Institute Press. You can get it at sophiainstitute.com. It’s a phenomenal book. I highly recommend it.
Bishop, I’d like to ask you what the laity can do. We can all work to educate and form ourselves better in the objective truth of what the Holy Mass is, what the Sacrifice of the Mass is, what Holy Communion is, and prepare ourselves spiritually to receive Our Lord fruitfully. This book helps greatly with that.
But I want to ask you specifically about the practice of kneeling and receiving Communion on the tongue. Can the faithful simply choose to do this on their own, even in the Novus Ordo?
You write in your book: “For a member of the faithful to continue to receive Communion kneeling and on the tongue in today’s circumstances requires great spiritual maturity and uncommon courage. Often, one’s freedom to choose is drastically reduced, as evidenced by many testimonies of individual believers.” I’ve heard stories where a layperson kneels down to receive on the tongue in the Novus Ordo, and the priest refuses and withholds Communion. They have no right to do that, correct? It is the right of the layperson to receive kneeling and on the tongue, is it not?
Bishop Athanasius Schneider: Of course. This is confirmed by Church law, in the document Redemptionis Sacramentum, issued by Pope John Paul II in 2004. It clearly states that every Catholic has the right to receive Holy Communion kneeling and on the tongue, and that it is a grave abuse if a priest denies this.
Communion in the hand and standing is still an indulgence, meaning it’s an exception to the rule, not the norm. According to the current law of the Church, Communion kneeling and on the tongue remains the rule, and Communion in the hand and standing is the exception.
Therefore, a priest has no right to deny Communion to a faithful person who wishes to receive kneeling and on the tongue. You must approach him with humility and respect, but also with firmness, insisting that he respect your right, which the Church gives you. Even if a bishop were to deny you, and yes, sadly, some bishops do this, it is still an abuse of power.
So, dear brothers and sisters, be witnesses of our Eucharistic Lord. The Lord is choosing you today. Be confessors of Jesus Christ in the moment of receiving Holy Communion. Don’t be afraid. Kneel down. Confess our Lord even before a priest, even before a bishop, and the Lord will confess you before the angels and before His Father in Heaven. Don’t be afraid. Kneel down with humility. And if you are denied Communion, go to another church where you are permitted to receive properly. It is worth it to be a confessor of the Eucharistic Lord. Be lovers of Jesus Christ in the Eucharist. Do Eucharistic Adoration attend perpetual adoration if possible, nocturnal adoration. Be defenders of the Eucharist. Make reparation. In places where Communion is given in the hand, you can be certain that there are small fragments lost. Go there, kneel down, kiss the floor, and offer prayers of reparation, perhaps the prayer of the Angel of Fatima, and offer it to the Lord.
Let us begin a new crusade, a Eucharistic crusade all over the world. Laypeople receiving kneeling and on the tongue, consoling Our Lord, atoning for irreverence, and defending Him.
Jim Havens: Yes, if we want a real Eucharistic revival, I highly encourage everyone to get this book, The Catholic Mass: Steps to Restore the Centrality of God in the Liturgy, at sophiainstitute.com.
Bishop, one last question. You write that today’s practice of Communion in the hand was legitimized almost as a form of forced extortion after an abuse. You say this because it was first introduced abusively, at a time when it was completely forbidden, and that bishops who tolerated or approved of the abuse later pressured Pope Paul VI to legitimize it. Can you speak to the fact that all of this comes from an act of disobedience?
Bishop Athanasius Schneider: Yes, of course. This is a historical fact. Communion in the hand began in the Netherlands, even during the Council, as an act of disobedience. It was an abuse. The Holy See admonished the bishops in the Netherlands to stop Communion in the hand, but they disobeyed.
From there, the practice spread like an epidemic to Belgium, Germany, France, Switzerland, Austria, especially during the last year of the Council and immediately afterward. Then Pope Paul VI tried to stop it. He issued a worldwide consultation of the bishops. He asked whether this practice should be introduced and whether it would endanger the faith or the sacredness of the Eucharist. The vast majority of bishops rejected Communion in the hand, warning of the dangers. This was in 1968.
Nevertheless, Pope Paul VI yielded to the pressure of bishops’ conferences in Central Europe and allowed it. This was a very tragic mistake with fatal consequences for Eucharistic reverence. He did state that Communion on the tongue should remain the rule, but it was not realistic. You cannot introduce a wolf into the sheepfold and say, “Please don’t hurt the sheep.” That is irresponsible.
He allowed it, despite knowing the risks. And after that, the Holy See under John Paul II continued to allow more and more bishops’ conferences to adopt this practice. We must confess this was very tragic. We must now return to defending Our Lord in the Eucharist. This form of objective desecration must stop. The entire Church must kneel to adore, love, and defend our Eucharistic Lord.
Jim Havens: Get the book: The Catholic Mass by Bishop Athanasius Schneider at sophiainstitute.com. Your Excellency, would you please close us with a final blessing?
Bishop Athanasius Schneider: Dominus vobiscum. Et cum spiritu tuo.
Dominus vobiscum, et cum, spiritu tuo. Et benedictio dei omnipotentis, Patris et Filii et spiritus Santi descendant, super vos et maneat semper. Amen
Praise be Jesus Christ.