Transcript:
Steve: Everybody, Steve is coming at you with a special guest. You probably have already heard of him, Bishop Athanasius Schneider. Your Excellency, thank you for coming on and speaking on this topic, and thank you for your time.
Bishop Athanasius Schneider: You’re welcome.
Steve: Now, we are having some technical difficulties. I am talking through the phone, people, so bear with us. So first, we will get right to it. What is the kingship of Christ?
Bishop Athanasius Schneider: The kingship of Christ is a very evident truth in the entire scripture. It is saying that Jesus Christ, the incarnate God, is also the Lord of all earthly realities, not only the Lord of heaven, but also the Lord of this earth, and he became man, that all things, as Saint Paul says in the letter to the Ephesians, that all things should be united under the kingship and the ruling of Jesus Christ, this incarnate Son of God. And in the First Corinthians, he says, Christ, in His humanity, must rule a ported illuminare in Latin, he must be the king. And so the entire creation, as Saint Paul writes, was created through Christ, through the Son, through the Word, and for him, all the creation the Father created through Him, and all beings were created for him.
And therefore, all realities of human beings, even the social life, were created and meant by God to be under the rule of Christ. Of course, every reality has its own rules, the spiritual life and the corporal life, the life of our body, the life of our soul, but nevertheless, both are created for Christ. And the same, the private life of human beings and the public or social life are created for Christ, and both. And therefore, in the tradition of the church, even starting in the first centuries, the Church Fathers said that the church or Christianity is the soul for humanity, as they make the comparison with the body and the soul. So we have this famous expression in the letter to Diagnosis. It is an old text from the end of the second century where is written this expression, “As the soul is for the body, so Christianity, the Christians, the Christianity of the church is for humanity, humankind or society.” And so we have this already from the first centuries. And the church always kept this that the Church of the faith Christianity is the soul and the temporal life, the social life, the political life, is like the body. And so church and society have to be together. You cannot divide them.
They have to be together, like the body and the soul together, to proclaim the glory of God. And so this is the same as the social kingship of Christ. Of course, he is the first Christ who has to be the king in the individuals. So every man has to accept Christ as his King and Lord through faith and baptism, but a human being is by nature. Shall also be. And therefore, the entire society has to proclaim Christ and accept Him as the Lord. There is no other Lord. And so society cannot be neutral towards God, or it will be practical. And atheism, and this is against the. And so we have the roots foundations of the kingship of Christ very clear in the Holy Scripture and in the teaching of the Fathers of the Church, and continuously in the text of the magisterium, especially the beautiful encyclical on the kingship of Christ of Pius the 11th, as we know from 1925, and therefore we have to accept this teaching and renew this.
Steve: Can a nation survive? And in particular, I am talking about the United States of America, without recognizing the kingship of Christ. The Constitution holds all religions in the United States. Can that last?
Bishop Athanasius Schneider: No, that cannot last because human beings, individually and for the entire society, are created for Christ. This is the meaning of the creation. And therefore, when a society rejects Jesus Christ, they cannot maintain well-being and peace. There will come a period when there will be a decade and moral or cultural degradation. We had witnessed this in history. You see in modern history, the dictatorships and the totalitarian political systems, let us say the French Revolution, dictatorships did not survive. And then there was the restoration in the 19th century. Then, let us take the Communist Revolution in Russia. It lasted 70 years, but then collapsed. It was a collapse spiritually, economically, and then the Nazi system of Hitler in Germany. Hitler proclaimed a 1000-year reign, Kingdom of the 1000 Year, Geri in Germany, in German, you see. But it lasts only 12 years because Hitler and the Nazis rejected Christ directly, and so and now, then the current modern society after the Second World War, and now we are witnessing is completely anti-Christian and rejecting Christ and the church. And so such a society will cause, over time, chaos and collapse. And we could see the chaos recently in these several manifestations of violence and all the instability and fear during the epidemic, and so on. So the society is showing they are helpless, and God shows them that without God, ultimately, without Christ, a society cannot survive.
Steve: You mentioned the F word fear. What can you say to fellow Catholics out there who are terrified by watching the TV, the media, and things like that, instead of, I want to say, they are not trusting in God. But how do you help them get over the fear and to trust in God, to not worry about things like this?
Bishop Athanasius Schneider: Yes, a Christian, a believer, has never to fear, never to fear, because we believe that God is with us. And so there is a saying in the Holy Scripture, “If God is with us, who is against us?” So this is a truth, a truth which we have to renew in our souls, and whoever believes in God is never alone, never alone. God, because God never abandons those who trust in him, never and therefore who believes is never alone, because Christ is not abandoning him who put his trust in Him and also a believer, a faithful has to be conscious that he is connected with others who believe in Christ, who are members of the Church, that we are connected together, like in a Body, a living body, in the Mystical Body of Christ, we all are together one body. Even if we are living in very distant places geographically. We are one in Christ, in the mystery of the church, and especially when we go to receive Holy Communion. We are united with all who are receiving, worthily, of course, the Holy Communion. And so we are together the one body of Christ, especially in the Most High and intense manner during the Holy Communion, or spiritual communion, or sacramental communion. Therefore, a Christian, the ref received as Catholics the sacrament of confirmation and the gifts of the Holy Spirit. But especially, there is one gift of the Holy Spirit which is so important for those who were confirmed, this is the gift of fortitude, fortitude, the fear to be fearless. Fearless fortitude. And so we are soldiers of Christ, soldiers have not to be fearful. What an army is this, who are fearful. They have to be an army without fear, because we are the soldiers of a very powerful commander, Jesus Christ, and on our sides are the holy angels. Everyone has their own guardian angel, their own guardian angel. So we have to be courageous. And so maybe these trials today, which are passing, remind us to renew that we have received the gift of fortitude so that in the old right, even the bishop is able to make a stroke on the face. So it is a symbol to show you should not be fearful. Do not be afraid. So this is, for me, an occasion to encourage the Catholics to renew the gift of the Holy Sacrament of confirmation.
Steve: Yes, we need a little slap on our face there, so wake us up. Thank you. But I could hug you for saying fortitude. I have not heard fortitude from anybody. It seems like the last couple of months. What would you like? What would you say to people who would get accused of pushing your religion on society, you know, like legislating morality, especially from a Catholic standpoint?
Bishop Athanasius Schneider: I would say these issues are not religious issues in the first place, and therefore the accusation is wrong, because if we defend what we are doing substantially, we are not first ushering in place the religious demands, I mean, but the demands of the natural law of all human beings of common sense. So, for example, we are defending life against abortion. We are not proclaiming the first place religious a Catholic truth. We are proclaiming a natural law for all people, for all religions, even for the atheists, the natural law not to kill innocent and fragile human beings, for example, or when we are defending marriage, the natural meaning of the Marriage of one man and one woman. This is inscribed in the being of every human being by God in the natural law. It is a natural revelation, not a supernatural revelation. Of course, we have for the same. Some truth, additional confirmation in the revelation of God in the Bible. But this is an additional revelation that you have not to you must not kill, and that God created marriage as one man, one woman, and so on. So you see, we have, I think we have to defend the common dignity and value of human beings.
Have not to say we are pushing our religion in society. No, we are defending the human being simply and common reason. And they are defending, by this, the stability of a society otherwise, this society that is killing their own babies on a mass scale and proclaiming such laws against nature as same sex unions and so on, this society will collapse, surely collapse, completely after some time. And so we are doing the best for society in defending life. And the natural marriage, the traditional marriage. This has nothing to do with tradition. It has to do with common sense, with reason. It has to do with nature, and of course, it has to do with the will of God, because this is the will of God as He created us. And only when we are fulfilling the will of God in nature will we be happy, and there will be peace. This is very evident. And so we are defending life and true marriage. We are only getting that we are becoming the benefactors of society. Will continue to reject society to reject, to trample the law of God and their own nature. Such a society will not survive. It will collapse. And also, we know from the history of the history, also from the second history salvation, that when humanity is reaching a so very dangerous point to blaspheme God, of blasphemy, of rejection of God in the natural law, then God will intervene. And these are the chastisements and the punishments which God sends. And this is written in Holy Scripture, in the last book of the New Testament, not the Old Testament.
The New Testament, the Revelation of John. So God has already given us what he will do, and he will do, and there are the angels of the punishments. You can read this in the apocalypses of Saint John. And this will come. And the entire Holy Scripture says that there will be a judgment of God. There will be, and we have to remind people of this reality. Otherwise, we are betraying humanity when we are silencing it; there will come a judgment of God, and this judgment can come tomorrow, we do not know. But from from the point of view of human observing and experience, when humanity will continue, Our Lady in Fatima said to to the humanity, “If people will continue to offend God, God will send a punishment,” and but this will be for the ultimately, also the punishments of God are for the good, at least to awaken people, then they do not continue to see and this is also an effect of the punishments of God that people are at least stopped to do horrible things. Of course not. Oh. It, but for the others’ evil.
And so, of course, the good ones are also suffering, but we are one. We are one family with all and so the good ones will accept this as a visitation of God, as a purification of their own souls, maybe of their own sins, and to be prepared better for the eternal life and God sends all only some punishments that from these he will how to say, take a mental good, ultimately, also for the church, for The souls and such a situation, maybe of persecution, of some punishments of God will purify the church also to be purified every persecution. Essence Peter writes in his first letter, “this is like a purifying fire, like the gold is plants purified in the fire.” So some Peter says the trials, the persecutions, are purifying the Christians and the church.
So we have to see, ultimately, even a possible punishment of God in the light of the providence of God, that God has all things in his hands, we have to renew our trust in the fatherly loving providence of God, who is also educating us and the entire humanity. And then do not forget that this earth and this life are only temporal. We are not perpetual, eternal here on this earth, and they will come. We are created for heaven, for their paradise, for the Beatitude, and they will come at the end. The world will end. So this is a truth of the faith, and God will create a new heaven and a new earth.
Steve: What do you see? The Consecration of Russia. I have been telling people to say, If this is peace, I do not want to see what war looks like. The last you know, 20 years have been anything but peaceful. Is there anything outside of a drastic miracle that we see coming up in the next 10 years to correct anything?
Bishop Athanasius Schneider: I think we have peace. God will only grant to humanity and to the church under the condition that we will observe His commandments; we cannot continue to offend God unpunished, and He will grant us peace. And therefore we have to make every effort to invite humanity society, to observe the law of God, at least the natural law of God, and then to proclaim Christ to all people with love, of course, not with pressure, no pressure, but with love, with convincing, with zeal. This Christ is the only Savior, and only in Christ, humanity will have a lasting peace. And only in Christ can we achieve true fraternity. But he is the peace. And so I think that this first to re-establish the observation, observance of the natural law of common reason, of common sense, I mean, and the reason in human society are through human culture, and at the same time to prove. Claim Christ everywhere and always, this love inviting people to accept Christ as their king.
Steve: What are some practical steps people can people might be listening saying, “Yeah, I am on board. It is great.” But how do I do that? Are there any practical examples you can give laity, Catholic politicians, etc, of ways to be able to move it to proclaim Christ the King? I am thinking like Garcia Moreno, for example. But are there any other ideas that come to mind that people can do?
Bishop Athanasius Schneider: Yes, a practical means it could be that we first appeal to people of goodwill in the society to, together with us, restore, because we have to start with the fundamental foundations. And this is a natural law. So to reestablish the family, the natural family, the values of the family, to expel from our society the genocide of abortion. Slowly and then to make maybe some good to spread some good literature and books and conferences on this issue of natural law, of the kingship of Christ, of a society, of the beauty of a society which is centered around Christ and the Christian faith, we can restore, try to restore, the Catholic culture, the beauty, for example, of architecture, the churches, the music, the theater. And so we have a lot of Catholic inheritance received from all the 2000 years. And try to build this up, to renew and with others accepting all which is some Paul said, “accept all which is true, which is honorable, which is beauty.” And so this could be, as I repeat, we have to make some coalitions with good people, even with non-Christians, non Catholics, because today, this battle is no more between the enemies of the church and the Catholic Church, but this is a battle between the Anti-Christ and humanity entirely. I mean, no, it is. At stake is the entire human family with these attacks against life and family. And so this is our first step, I think, and then build up Catholic culture, and, of course, also to organize prayer groups to proclaim Christ the King. So these three steps, I mean, with the natural law, the people of goodwill, and then restore, slowly, partly, the Catholic culture, values, and then the associations of prayers.
Steve: Are there any modern areas, nations that are doing that, or close to doing that, or thinking about doing that, or is it right now? Nobody’s come close right now.
Bishop Athanasius Schneider: No, today, the world is difficult because, you know, we are living in a globalized world, and so the anti Christian, anti human mentality, they are spread all over the world within one second, in one instant, through the mass media, all people are in some way contaminated with this mentality against natural law, against Christ and so on. But thanks be to God, there are in several countries, especially young people, who still keep the natural instinct of truth, of beauty, of the natural law of reason, and they are trying to also. On a social level, to reintegrate, reintegration of the Christian faith and Christ. There are in Poland some groups that want to promote Christ, taking on a public level. For example, in Hungary, at least, there is a government that is promoting family and natural law. So there are some steps, but there are very few. I think that we have to, since the entire political scenario has become more global, globalized, and in some way interconnected, and lastly, directed by a kind of central power. It is difficult for a concrete country, but I think that maybe some countries in Europe, Christian, could make a coalition, at least to promote the Christian values, the values of natural law, and then the Christian culture. And then make some international coalitions, for example, to promote politicians, politicians who will promote the natural law, politicians, people who are in politics, social life, to promote the values of a Catholic culture, for example.
Steve: Would you tell or recommend anybody to basically go run for office, especially to help, not save society, I guess, but help promote the kingship of Christ is if they have the opportunity, if they have the means, and they have the knowledge. Obviously, no one, just anybody, is jumping into the idea for it. But would you recommend that Catholics get involved and try to fix, kind of like a word, infiltrate, in a sense, politics, to be able to change the course of action?
Bishop Athanasius Schneider: It depends on the countries. I think it will be more difficult in the United States, because this country is a very secular political tradition, and not Catholic, and so the Protestant tradition. They never promoted Christ, the King, as a social kingship. You know, it is. It is a Catholic idea and a Catholic tradition from the times of the New Testament and the Fathers of the Church and the entire 2000 years. But maybe we can approach these things in our protests and brothers to approach them. The meaning of Christ the King, especially this beautiful encyclical of Pius the 11th, class Primus. This could be a help to make together, because only a Catholic will not achieve in this our time, some effects and results we have to have a coalition and to good Protestants, evangelical believers, who would also promote this, this idea of Christopher King in society. Maybe so. But at least we can do this, maybe on a local level, on the regional level, first to to make some to dedicate a city or a town or a village to Christ, to His Sacred Heart, that he will be because the king of our hearts and of this village, of the Son of the city, maybe then of this county or this region. So I think we have to proceed in small steps. But this is already worthwhile, even if one village will proclaim Christ or consecrate themselves to Christ, the King to his royal heart. It will already be progress. So we have to go by small steps to spread and proclaim Christ the King.
Steve: That is an excellent point, because many people get the spare if they look at the global idea of it, and even that goes to evangelization, right there. Start local, your neighborhood, your village, and then eventually it spreads out. I know I thought about getting Michael Davies’ book on the kingship of Christ. Tan books have it for a bulk, for 100, I think, is $1 each. And just pass those out to the people. I gave one to a senator about five years ago. Are there any books besides, I think, yours, Christus Vincit obviously, and Michael Davies’ book? Are there any other books that you would recommend people read?
Bishop Athanasius Schneider: Maybe it could also be read the work of Saint Augustine on the City of God. Of course, it is not so easy in every part to read this, but to have a global idea of the victory of the City of God against the city of the evil of the city of man. So this work of Saint Augustine gives us also a realistic vision of what is happening in history, but also proclaims the victory. And this is a work of the first centuries, for example. So we have the texts and the works of our time, but also of these first Fathers of the Church, Augustine, his famous work on the City of God, for example. And also we can read, maybe biographies of good Catholic Christian kings who were really dedicated to Christ. The King, let us say, St Louis, the King of France, his life, for example, or the life of the last Catholic emperor, blessed Emperor Carl of Austria, and to spread the knowledge of his Life, the knowledge of what he did, of his words. So it could also encourage people to say that even kings and emperors were dedicated entirely to Christ and or, for example, a beautiful example of the Portuguese kings, I do not remember the exact name of this thing, but I think it was a king, or in the 16 or in the 17th century, who brought his crown, the royal crown, and put this crown at the feet of Our Lady and declared her the queen. And since then, the Portuguese kings have not worn the royal crown because they gave the crown to Our Lady. For example, they have to spread. For example, it could be good for a scholar, because a Catholic scholar could write a book with these examples, or with good politicians. Another good politician, Catholic politician from the 19th century is the Spanish Donoso Cortés in who was a very committed Catholic politician. It is also an example of his writings and his life. So we have to present concrete examples.
Steve: Final question for you, I’ll let you go. Is church and state? I know it is a pretty new phenomenon, basically from French Revolution times, but what is the role in the state, in the church? We all know that the Church teaches us no separation of church and state, but what is the role of the church supposed to be on top of the state? Is the State study on top of the church? It seems today the state is on top of the church. And if I am correct, it used to be the church telling the state what to do.
Bishop Athanasius Schneider: We have to observe the order that God gave, and then it will function. Good. When we pervert the order of God, then we have chaos, and there is no peace, and there is no progress. And as we already mentioned at the beginning of our talks. The faith or the church has a function of the soul towards the human being or the society. So the soul, but in our life, the soul is, of course, unquestionably, the guiding role. Our soul is guiding the body, our body. And so in some way, God put the soul over the body to guide the body. And so the same God gave the church the Christianity, the faith, the church, to give orientation to guide the state the society, with some orientations, but only what belongs to common sense or to Natural Law, and which is such a morality and so but of course, both have their competencies and have to respect the mutual competencies as in our body. You know, our soul has to respect also the competencies of our body. When the soul says, “Oh, you have to pray. We have you have to all the 24 hours.” It is impossible. So the body says, “Oh, I will not obey your soul. I have to sleep.”
Otherwise, I will become sick, and I cannot serve God. So the soul has to respect the laws of the body, but the body has also to respect the laws of the soul and obey, so when the body will only sleeps all day. And in the souls, the note is not correct, you have to work, you have to pray. And so the soul is reminding the body of the eternal truth. And so on. In the same way as the church, the church cannot. How do you say it takes the competency of pure temporal or scientific, or economic issues?
This is the competency of the government of the state, so the threat has no need to worry about climate change or other of the waters of the ocean; this is a competency, or of the garbage. How you you order the garbage and the fresh? This is the competency of the government, not of the church. The church has to be competent to remove the crap of things and not the material. This is the competency and so on. So they have to observe the competency of and therefore the government has no competence in liturgy, as today, in this epidemic season, some governments have made church prescriptions that you cannot understand how you have to do the right of distribute Holy Communion. This is another competency of the government. This is a typical and proper competence of the church in their case. I mean, so, albeit the government, the state, has to accept the guidance, the directions, the moral, I mean, the moral directions of the church and also in the government, the state, the society, has the moral duty from natural law, to worship God, to give honor to God as a society and as a state. Otherwise, it will be atheistic, and this is against natural and against divine commandment and but how to give honor to God, how to worship the government has to ask the church, “what is the true manner to worship God and the church?” He says, “only one true manner is to adore the Most Holy Trinity, Father, Son, and Holy Ghost in the Catholic Church, with Christ, which Christ establishes himself, only one church. There are no two realities. The Christ of the church. And the Catholic Church?
No, there is one the same. There is only one church. This is the church of Christ, which he founded, and this is the Catholic Church here on Earth.” And so we have to know this, but I repeat and to summarize the Covenant, the state and the church or the faith, have to go together. Maybe we can also compare this with this beautiful image, with John Paul the second of John Paul the second gave the relationship between reason and faith. So it is like a bird with its two wings. So a bird has to have two wings to fly up into the air. And this is the reason and faith, nature and grace, state and church. So the Catholic and the true divine method is the synthesis, synthesis, and this is the way of God.
Steve: Amen to that. I just forgot about saying thank you for this. Some priest friends of mine ended Communion in the hand because of your book. At one of their parishes, they introduced intention, passed out your book to every parishioner at their parish. After about a month or two, they gradually went to regular Aladdin style. Communion went away with the intention, and now they have nobody at the nobody at parish who receives in their hand. They are all kneeling at the altar, on their tongue. And I know of two parishes that have done that in this particular diocese. So not only did Bishop Schneider write the book Christus Vincit, he also wrote this book, Dominus Est, which is must read for anybody out there.
Bishop Athanasius Schneider: Yes, I am all we have to be happy and desire that Christ, our Lord in the Holy Eucharist, be more venerated, respected, and exteriorly so, as St Thomas Aquinas said in his Eucharistic hymn, in relating Eucharist, “do all what You can or dare to give Christ as much honor as you can there.” So this is how the ut Christo quam maximam ibi honorem tribuas in Latin and the other expression in his hymn, which we prayed last week on the feast of Corpus Christi, Dominus nos visitet. It means “a lord visit us”, now, me, personally, my family, the church, and our world with Grace to the extent that we honor you with the Eucharist. Honor our Lord in the Eucharist, so he will give us grace in the entire church.
Steve: And your Excellency. Thank you very much for your time. Can we get a final blessing before you go?
Bishop Athanasius Schneider: Dominus vobiscum.
Steve: Et cum spiritu tuo.
Bishop Athanasius Schneider: Benedicat vos omnipotens Deus, Pater, et Filius, ✠ et Spiritus Sanctus.
Steve: Amen.